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Good, Bad, & Ugly - Round 2


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#1 G-WizZ

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 03:07 PM

It's time for another installment of Good, Bad, & Ugly, where we elaborate on features in the Grand Theft Auto game series that we think should or shouldn't make their way into GTAV. If you missed last week's writeup, want to find out more about these articles, or you just can't get enough world class rhetoric, check it out here.

The Good: Car Customization
I would have very much enjoyed creating some unique vehicles to park at my safe houses in GTA4 and actually make my save spots feel useful. I did like that there were rarer, modified versions of certain cars occasionally driving around (the 'performance' versions of the Feroci, Intruder, and Presidente, to name a few), but how often did you come across them? In GTAV we are heading back to Los Santos and the surrounding etceteras, where the people are tan and state law requires 100-spoke gold wheels on every car over ten years old. The custom car shops in San Andreas allowed you to change the exhaust, wheels, and paint, add hood scoops and spoilers, and even hydraulics to a variety of vehicles. If Transfender is still in business you should expect to see at least all of these options from eight years ago, if not more (hello, tinted windows?). I will be shocked if car customization isn't in GTAV as this has to be one of the most requested features since 2004. What good is a drive-by if you aren't rolling on 22's? At an absolute minimum I would want to see a color palette when visiting the Pay N Spray. It's rather irritating to pull a Sabre GT in and out of the garage fifteen times before it gives me the base/stripe color combo I desire.

The Bad: Money
Vice City had asset properties, and San Andreas more safe houses than ticks on a monkey's ass, all of which you could spend your hard-earned virtual cash on. GTA4 had...weapons and taxi rides. I don't know about you, but my Niko is a millionaire with nothing to show for it but a crappy apartment. What's the point in rewarding us with money when there's nothing to spend it on? We may as well win expired coupons for killing that gang member and stealing his dope. Reintroducing car modifications is a great way for the player to start spending money. Reward yourself for shooting down that police helicopter by painting a Trashmaster pink and throwing a nitrous bottle in the back. Let us buy a landing strip (another thing San Andreas did right) and an airplane to go with it. In similar fashion, you could buy a safe house by the water and save boats at your dock. Or even buy extra parking spaces or a garage to save all of those bitchin' cars you just customized.

Honorable Mention: Hidden Packages. In order to 'collect' the pigeons in GTA4, you had to kill them, which more often than not gave you a wanted star and a nasty phone call from PETA. I think I only bothered with four or five before saying fuck it. Go back to the old ways and use bricks of cocaine. Maybe give the packages more meaning - the more you collect, the more leverage you have in brokering a drug deal which could be a part of a mission later in the game.

The Ugly: Traffic Spawning
The mechanic for spawning NPC traffic has been a straight-up catastrophe since GTA3 (not a typo). It seems that NPC traffic is generated based on what the player is driving, and not what the rest of the pedestrians are, or even depending on the area of the city. It took me forever to find a Super Diamond driving around in the Ballad of Gay Tony, and once I jacked it, I drove through a shitbox part of town and saw six more parked on the street. Further, if you exit your vehicle, traffic seems to vanish. Whatever is within the draw distance at that time is all you've got to work with, and after that, vehicles stop spawning almost completely. If I want to leave my car and get in position to JFK some fool in a convertible, by the time I climb the ladder there are no more cars on the road. What. The. Balls. And since it appears we will be able to pilot airplanes in GTAV, spawn some real (read: explodable) NPC-driven planes in the sky to compose air traffic, instead of the typical solid, indestructible dummies. I know I'm not the only person who would chase and then shoot down a civilian plane while doing a barrel roll in a Hydra.
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#2 JCMoorehead

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 04:55 PM

Good edition of it this week, definitely agree on all points especially money. If they can introduce a few more elements like car customisation (Well re-introduce) then it'll at least be one step of the way there. I do always think you'd going to get to a point in GTA or any game like this where you have more money than you'll ever need but why not make it so it takes a lot longer to get to that moment. Car Customisation, more businesses to take over, safe-houses, etc.
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#3 G-WizZ

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 06:17 PM

View PostJCMoorehead, on 05 March 2012 - 04:55 PM, said:

I do always think you'd going to get to a point in GTA or any game like this where you have more money than you'll ever need but why not make it so it takes a lot longer to get to that moment.

this
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#4 SwissMiss33

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:16 PM

Fan-f*cking-tastic. Wizz, good work as always.

I have to agree with all 3 on this one.

- The Flying Rats used to piss me off, one shot, police all over you or peds with guns start shooting. Bring back the Secret Packages.

Now what do with this all this cash?
-I would have loved to be able to purchase some of those McMansions in (Alderney?) and save my cars in those hugh garages.
- Maybe purchase cars at a dealership. (seems kinda redundant since the game is called Grand Theft Auto). But since a lot of the recent main characters of GTA have had some sort of conscience, maybe purchasing a car/truck/plane/boat may bring a new element to the game.
- Purchasing empty land, and be able to buy a house/garage (with a different selection to pick from) and place it on said land.
- Also buying products perhaps? (Clothing, health items, inventory).
- YES.. YES.. to Vehicle Customization. Want it, need it, gotta have it. Nothing says HOT SHIT, like a Banana Yellow V8 Manana with NOS. (one of the many new customizations that could be added is to upgrade the engine/drive wheels. (making for a faster car)

One of my biggest peeves was the oddball inconsistent Traffic spawning. Ran into the same situation you did with the Super Diamond, also with the Willard. Sure, it's a piece of crap, but a fun car to drive and do burnouts. Can't find it anywhere, once you do, they are PARKED and driving ALL over.
Does anyone remember in GTA SA the farm tractors and motorcyclists that would be doing 80 mph on the mountain highways, that would ALWAYS either get in your way or rear end you. I'm glad they *kinda* fixed that a tad. But still having 20 Vapid Taxi's on the highway no matter what your driving gets a tad annoying.



Loving this Good, Bad and Ugly! Keep up the good work!
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#5 G-WizZ

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:58 PM

these aren't all just my ideas. i took a bunch of ideas from the topic on the old forum from people like CC, TJD, Jesus_Is_Good, mattus, JCM, etc
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#6 DrRodneyMckay

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 11:38 AM

oh yes dear god please, the traffic inconstancy was a major pet-peeve of mine and many others it seems, driving past a car you've been searching for for hours stopping literally in front of it getting out turning around and for some reason it seems to have turned into a taxi.. and when you finally do get it, there's bloody hundreds of them.

Money wise, i always felt for certain missions you got a little too much for doing so little, and yet for others you got so little for doing so much, but then again in a game centred around stealing shizz, i suppose balancing ""money"" making is slightly difficult. but i do agree, purchasing cars would be a good idea and to make a bit more authentic have something along the lines that (i think was in Vice or maybe san andreas) where other people used to steal cars too, i mean theres supposed to be a massive criminal network in these games yet you hardly see anything going on that isn't directly related to you. Maybe have a theft system, because lets face, there isn't a chance in hell your carrying around $2Million in your wallet so maybe have people trying to steal it from your safe house etc. could be a decent way of keeping the money balanced in game.

as for the car customisation, I wonder how much space it would take up to have a vinyl editor in game, i.e something similar but obviously a bit less complex to the paint shop they have in Forza.

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#7 SwissMiss33

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 04:24 PM

Some other ideas/wants for the Good Bad and Ugly section.


As I was posting a ton of pictures to our Earlier GTA section. It got me thinking about the HOT COFFEE cheat.

Wonder if there was a way to incorporate sex with out the annoying dating/phone calls and a NC-17 rating?

Also with the picking up of hookers/prostitutes, maybe be able to take them to a hotel/save house aside from just doing them in your vehicle. Maybe make strip clubs actually usable. Im not asking for nudity (although its preferred, :P ), but be able to spend your hard earned GTA dollars on girls dancing (maybe the more you pay the more they strip, or do a more seductive dance). Be able to buy drinks at the bar. Purchase a lap dance, where you can pick a girl and or song (which you can kinda already do). Maybe one the side missions could be to collect strippers panties, sounds about par for GTA's nastiness.

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I much preferred the clothing system in GTA San Andreas. Where you could purchase a wide variety of clothing from a ton of different stores. I really hope they bring this back, this time add women's clothing, because there nothing better then a cross dressing, car stealing maniac running around town with a 6 foot pink dildo.

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This time how about a sports team you an actually watch. Much like the Liberty City Cocks. But instead of an empty stadium with a ton of cheering as you drive by, you can see a bunch of peds wearing sports uniforms playing some kinda sport if you walk in. That you can drive your car though and ruin their day. Or having a stadium to run around in, with different levels, may make for a decent shoot-out mission.


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Bring back the MALL. I loved Vice City's Mall. just wish more stores were useable or had interiors. Driving around the mall in the "CHANCE TO WIN" - Infernus. stoping off at the eatery to eat then shoot them all dead.

Parking Garages and/or Parking Lots (can work with the Mall). May come in handy for finding cars/trucks. Some good open space for doing tricks.
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#8 SwissMiss33

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 04:25 PM

View PostDrRodneyMckay, on 07 March 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

oh yes dear god please, the traffic inconstancy was a major pet-peeve of mine and many others it seems, driving past a car you've been searching for for hours stopping literally in front of it getting out turning around and for some reason it seems to have turned into a taxi.. and when you finally do get it, there's bloody hundreds of them.

Money wise, i always felt for certain missions you got a little too much for doing so little, and yet for others you got so little for doing so much, but then again in a game centred around stealing shizz, i suppose balancing ""money"" making is slightly difficult. but i do agree, purchasing cars would be a good idea and to make a bit more authentic have something along the lines that (i think was in Vice or maybe san andreas) where other people used to steal cars too, i mean theres supposed to be a massive criminal network in these games yet you hardly see anything going on that isn't directly related to you. Maybe have a theft system, because lets face, there isn't a chance in hell your carrying around $2Million in your wallet so maybe have people trying to steal it from your safe house etc. could be a decent way of keeping the money balanced in game.


Dr.R, I like your idea with the theft system. Seeing others stealing cars/shooting at cops and stuff of the like - even pick pocketing you.

But if they are constantly attacking your save house, then your back to square one having to drive all the way back to fight them off. Would be kinda like that shitty system in GTA Vice City Stories with the side businesses always being attacked. That drove me nutz, I was in the process of doing something (mission/screens shot/side mission), then BAM... your business is being attacked again and again. Not sure I want that.
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#9 DrRodneyMckay

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Posted 07 March 2012 - 10:20 PM

View PostSwissMiss33, on 07 March 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:


But if they are constantly attacking your save house, then your back to square one having to drive all the way back to fight them off. Would be kinda like that shitty system in GTA Vice City Stories with the side businesses always being attacked. That drove me nutz, I was in the process of doing something (mission/screens shot/side mission), then BAM... your business is being attacked again and again. Not sure I want that.

im sure they could find a way to make it a bit less like the Turf Gang Wars in San Andreas, mayb by having something like the Gang recruitment thing that used to be in san andreas where u used to be able to have your gang member follow you, but sort of like assign them to areas to protect, so when your safe houses get attacked and your not there, you lose a bit of money and possibly a few men, but if you are there you lose no money or if there is noone guarding it then u lose a lot of cash. but then again i suppose thats asking for a hell of a lot, especially to make this all fit on a DVD... whats the bet we get 2 or 3 possibly even 4 discs for XBOX :(

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#10 G-WizZ

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 12:18 AM

multiple discs are almost gonna be a definite, especially if they use the facial expression stuff like in LA Noire
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#11 DrRodneyMckay

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 07:04 PM

i really hope they don't use the facial stuff..... i mean its fantastic visually n all but it adds nothing to a game like GTA, LA noire yes because it help with the interrogations n such but GTA... it would be a bit of over kill i think

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#12 G-WizZ

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 07:18 PM

I agree we could do without it but lately GTA cutscenes have been getting longer and longer, and they spent all that time and money perfecting it they probably will want to keep using it.
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#13 JCMoorehead

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 10:29 PM

GWizZ is right, they'll probably want to use it because of the money and time spent in perfecting it but also because it does look fantastic visually. They will want their characters to look and react realistically as far as animation goes, it's a great piece of tech to see put to use.
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#14 DrRodneyMckay

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 10:32 PM

it is, but they haven't used it on Max Payne have they so.... Didn't they even say that they did it just to see if it could be done?

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#15 JCMoorehead

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 10:54 PM

They probably haven't used it on Max Payne because Max Payne was well into production before the tech was licensed by Rockstar. Don't forget LA Noire wasn't originally going to be published by Rockstar it was originally going to be published by Sony as a PS3 exclusive but Team Bondi fucked up massively and Rockstar bailed them out.

It might not be used in GTAV but GTA tends to be the big showcase for all of Rockstars tech they have and have helped develop so it is likely.
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#16 DrRodneyMckay

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 10:56 PM

i wouldnt supprise me if it is in there, but i just think the game could be better without it, i mean imagine how much disc space that takes up... id prefer a bigger map or a heap load of extra missions, etc.

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#17 JCMoorehead

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 11:02 PM

View PostDrRodneyMckay, on 08 March 2012 - 10:56 PM, said:

i mean imagine how much disc space that takes up... id prefer a bigger map or a heap load of extra missions, etc.

The tech behind it probably not too much space, the textures will be what takes up most space especially if they're uncompressed. Missions probably won't take up too much space seeing as they're just a few lines of code. It's the assets themselves that require disc space not the code or engines.
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#18 DrRodneyMckay

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 11:04 PM

yeah but, Disc space for Realistic faces or Disc space for Extra game content, what would you preffer?

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#19 JCMoorehead

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Posted 08 March 2012 - 11:50 PM

I'd rather have my cake and eat it :)
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#20 DrRodneyMckay

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Posted 09 March 2012 - 12:31 AM

anyway i think we got a bit caught up n went slightly off topic....

we got much in the pipeline fore Episode 3?

Base Jumping was fantastic, especially off the mountain.

mayb another large passenger airliner, or at least more variety of aircraft

and ammo, make it slightly less easy to aquire, make it feel like you actually have to aim and shoot rather than just spray n hope people die

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